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  1. #1
    Entropy is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default She was in my flat. I did kino. What went wrong?

    Apologies for cross-posting, but I will never sleep again unless I get some feedback on this.

    Over two dates (totalling about six hours in total) I managed to get a 21yr HB8 back to my flat. We had just finished up in Starbucks:

    Her: 'Ah well, no more tea.'

    Me: 'I've got much better tea back in my flat. Let's go.'

    Her: 'OK.'

    Tea? in Starbucks? Yeh that's right; I'm British, so a pot of green tea for lunch everyday. She is Polish, and this all takes place in a big city in Poland on a recent holiday I had there. IMPORTANT INFO: This girl has had a BF of four years, and told me she only came out with me because she missed me. (I live in Sri Lanka for work, and hadn't visited Poland for about a year.) After the First Date, she told me she was glad I was leaving for Colombo again soon, as she didn't think she could face any more 'tests' for her fidelity. I texted her that if she met me again I would give her an 'aggressive and comprehensive' test. She immediately replied she would see me the next day, and was looking forward to being tested. As you can imagine, I was therefore confident about the second date.

    Now before I left to meet her in Starbucks, I had purposely put lots of stuff on the three chairs in the flat (Flats in Poland are commonly T0 - a medium sized room with kitchen, living room and bed all in one enclosed space.)so she would have to sit on the bed. Returning to the flat, though, the spearmint green tea in my bladder, having worked all its anti-oxidant super magic on my body, needed immediate release. So of course, while I was taking care of that she simply unencumbered a chair. Entering the room, I saw her sitting solo, looking hot. I even felt my cheeks flush.

    Not to worry though. I made us both a cup of tea (flavoured with toffee and banana - not sure if girls like that, but a fave of mine certain enough) and placed her cup with mine on the floor at the top of the bed.

    With no pause or complaint, she immediately came and sat with me. We talked for a while, and I lay down. She lay down too, and we were both close.

    I left it like this for a couple of minutes, thinking it would be good to let her get comfortable lying next to me in bed, before I started to escalate the kino.

    And then of course, the time came. And I lay there thinking 'Oh yeh, how do I do that?'

    It would have just seemed very odd to me to start stroking her hair, face or - heaven forfend! - stomach, so we just lay there together chatting. She of course, was not going to start touching me.

    I had a bottle of water by the bed, which I had to lean over to get. Leaning over her. So I put my body weight on her when I picked up the bottle. She was lying on her belly. I put my right hand on her neck, and pushed my groin into her arse as I leaned over.

    She gave me a look associated with danger and daggers. A warning look, one might say.

    'Sorry, necessary to get the water. Mmm lovely, lovely water.'

    She laughed and shook her head like 'You're crazy' mixed with 'I honestly can't believe you did that.'

    This provided me with an intro though, and I started stroking her back and sides. She gave no resistance for about a minute, and then the warning look came back. So I held off.

    Now at this point I should point out that during our dates, any canned material or PUA routine I tried out on this girl was rebuffed or bombed. She could tell when I 'shifted' into a routine and immediately clammed up. So I had just been being my charming, very flirtatious self for the most part to get this far. But, as we shall see, Escalation of kino and kiss closes are my sticking point.

    So, with the fact canned material doesn't work on this girl, I got desperate and tried Style's 'evolution phase-shift' :

    Her: 'I'm not biting your neck.'

    Then I tried biting hers, she giggled and pushed me off. I kept going thinking 'ok caveman!' Then she got annoyed and gave me the look of death again.

    I made a joke and told her I'd sit on my hands.

    After five minutes of lying down and talking again, I tried Mystery's famous kiss-close:

    'Do you want to kiss me?'
    'Ha ha, I didn't say you could. . . ' etc etc

    I even tried that line from Milan Kundera's 'The Unbearable Lightness of Being':

    ME: 'Take off your clothes.'
    HER: 'You're weird. And very optimistic.'

    After the material didn't work, I went natural again, and explained that I really wanted to kiss her, take her clothes off etc. She replied that she knew, but due to her BF no chance, etc.

    I kept on going with this, and made a couple more caveman attempts, which led to me getting the most I got out of the whole interaction: A couple of two second lip-undulating kisses. No tongue.

    Now I know that one should go Freeze Out here, to elicit the girl wanting to bring back the earlier close, intimate behaviour. But fear of her just getting bored stopped me from doing this, or doing it effectively.

    After my second-caveman innocent kiss, I sat up on the other end of the bed and started to check email on my iPod with my back to her. Total freeze out with no talking. She bent over on her knees to face me and get closer. . . but just continued to talk. She did ask me why I wasn't lying down again, and I explained I respected her right to say no and reject me, and that I therefore had to kill the atmosphere to stop myself getting frustrated.

    Perfect freeze-out? After I said this she looked genuinely quite upset, and I felt so guilty I just made an awful joke like:

    'Ha ha I respect a women's right to say no; for five minutes.'

    And then pushed her down on the bed again, to resume the playful game of attempt and rebuff. After ten minutes more of this - during which time I had stroked her tight, bronzed, little belly; squeezed her breasts; and got a couple more short kisses - the inside of my jeans were covered in pre-cum from an erection I was genuinely considering beating us both to death with.

    I broke state and escorted her to her tram stop, pausing once for one more kiss.

    So gentlemen:

    What could I have done to have sex with this girl, or at least get some sex action going?

    Was the problem my kino?

    Was it that I broke the freeze-out as I couldn't handle the upset look on her face?

    I've put loads of detail in this for you to diagnose something else I might have missed.

    It was the BF wasn't it? Am I evil for even getting this far knowing she a had a BF of four years? I think she just wanted some semi-innocent fun at my expense, and loved the attention; but had no intention of ever going further than those furtive little kisses.

  2. #2
    Gwkiller69 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: She was in my flat. I did kino. What went wrong?

    "She did ask me why I wasn't lying down again, and I explained I respected her right to say no and reject me, and that I therefore had to kill the atmosphere to stop myself getting frustrated."

    I think this was your crucial mistake. You gave it all away here. You let her know that you're really into her and that you have to stay away in order to not get too excited. You used the phrase "reject me", which probably also isn't the best.
    In an ideal freeze out, you're not supposed to do that. You should go check your email, let her initial conversation and verbally show that things are alright, while your actions should show they're not. In other words you should stay cool, in state and happy no matter what. The theory is that if you do this, she will realized what she's about to let go and start putting in effort to get you back. Instead, you changed the frame by making yourself look as though you're the one chacing, getting frustrated and being rejected(even if you are, you gotta be like ice and keep your cool).
    All in all, I think you did everything well except for the verbal part of the freeze out.

  3. #3
    xavier's Avatar
    xavier is offline PUA All Star
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    Default Re: She was in my flat. I did kino. What went wrong?

    the groin on the ass thing is a douchy move. not the worst freeze out but it should have been u don't want things to escalate and i respect u for that, so i'm backing off.
    what u could have done better:
    -bf destroy here's how: u of course need to use the LTR bf destroyer
    -u should freeze out between u're attempts for about 15 min or u should change the subject to something totally unrelated to sex
    -to kino u start by touching hands and extremities then kness and lower thighs and then hair and face then u start kissing look up the dicarlo escalation ladder
    -yes u shouldn't have broken the freeze out just cuz she looked upset u break it when she starts talking to u and wants to rebuild rapport with u
    -maybe she did want the attention but that only means that her relationship has one or all of the problemes i exposed in my thread and u can play on that to f-close
    "The world will never change much less become what you want it to be. The only thing that can change is you. Face your fears, grow stronger and become what you want to be."

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