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Thread: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

  1. #11
    PUA Bart is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    Yeah, it sounds awkward to tell her that. It sounds like I have to tell her I am not a real man. But I will talk about that to her.

    Is picking her up a good idea this friday? I really have trouble doing kind stuff and opening up to people I like. If I like someone, I do nothing but laugh and do fun stuff. I have no problem with that. I have difficulties with being nice with people I like, although I am also not a jerk. I can hand out compliments to everyone. But as soon as I feel I like someone, I completely shut down. Damn, I feel like i have hard issues to tackle here.

  2. #12
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    ButMan 'lol' is right,let your personality shine and touch her with warm and respect.D not crash the butterfly you hold in your hand.
    Tell her about your fears ,your childhood and share her fears with yours...combination
    You attract the type of woman you are.She senses unconsiously your personality and she likes you.Now she think if you are true or try to fake.
    (again Batman is right,he knows many secrets)
    Trust Thoughts-Words-Actions
    No permission boy
    Fat CEO

  3. #13
    PUA Bart is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    This girl mailed me yesterday, in reaction to my "I like to get to know you better first before I come to a birthday party amidst your family, friends and parents. It makes me feel uncomfortable because I don't know you very well yet and how I feel about you AND I wouldn't know what to buy you. Don't get me wrong, I really like you. I like the way you keep me company on parties all the time, I like the fact you keep following me around, I like the fact you do so much effort to be with me everytime we see each other, I think you're sexy and clumsy in a cute way and I still love the little embarrassing story you told about yourself when we first met. I really appreciate that stuff, but it's nothing real and it's so superficial... I simply don't feel I know you, and I think you don't really know me either. So let's continue getting to know each other by doing stuff togheter like dancing, ice skating, whatever, ... before inviting me into your more intimate circle."

    She replied something like this:

    There won't be family on my birthday party, only the female friends you see everytime we go out and one of which you already spoke to for a while. She thinks you're cool. AND you don't have to bring me a present, just bring something to eat or drink with you. So you don't have to feel uncomfortable. I would like to keep doing fun stuff with you. I love ice skating. If you like we can walk my dog together or stuff like that.

    I expected her to repeat the fact that she doesn't feel attraction to me anymore, because I said I don't know yet how I feel about her, that's she's sexy and that I would love to find out why I like her, but she didn't repeat it. I think I best loosen up and really open up to her and listen to her as well instead of keep busting her balls and teasing her all the time (that's all I ever did). I also think it's time the action dates (dancing dancing dancing) become more of let's do something while we try to get to know each other and talk to each other dates.

    I am seeing her this evening (depending on the weather, she is affraid of driving in the snow), so I will accept her invitation to go the her party and to walk her dog sometime soon and to maybe arrange an ice skating date.

    It's really a revelation to me. I avoided the getting to know each other part and was becoming too hard to get. For years I didn't know why girls did not commit to LTR's with me after making out or having sex... they were always confused and left me instantaniously. Or to be more exact they gave me the LJBF speech and I felt rejected... but now I am starting to think there are different kinds of friendzones, of which not all of them are unescapable. Whereas I was convinced attraction was the most important part of the game... I am starting to realize attraction is just a small part of the game, once you have it, it's time to try and build that emotional connection instead of avoiding to build it. The game is played during comfort, but you have to show you are not desperate and wait for attraction first to happen before moving into comfort.

    I guess getting stuck in attraction phase, like me, is easier salvageble than getting stuck in the comfort phase?

  4. #14
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    That's awesome to hear. I see a lot of guys so worried about looking needy that they never get intimate with a woman emotionally. And women are emotional creatures! It's like they forgot that women find the willingness to emote very attractive.

    There's definitely a risk of looking needy. But if you balance it with your attraction game you should have no problem. I get mushy gushy with my gf. And thats because I still tease her from time to time. Gotta be flexible with your game and emotions.

    I can tell by her response that she is into you. I guarantee if you start to let her in and she knows that you aren't like that with anyone else, she will be pudding in your hand and she will love you.

    Again, awesome revelation. You just opened a door to a whole different set of game that Pickup doesn't touch upon too often. Good luck.
    "All things are subject to interpretation. Whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth."

  5. #15
    PUA Bart is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    I think the community sometimes has too much tunnelvision. I am registered on a Belgian PUA forum and I made the same topic, but I did not stress the fact that all we did up until now is casual stuff and having fun together. All the replies I got was I was too needy, too soft, not challenging enough, etc... And I am sure most of the time this is THE reason why people get LJBF but as I know exactly what went on between us I knew I wasn't showing needy behaviour and being too easy. Now they were right, I am too soft, but it shows as me being very distant and hard to reach. And I admit, after trying to talk sense into them I wasn't showing all those bad qualities, they started to think you can indeed hear the dreaded LJBF when you don't build a connection or report.

    I think we - the PUA community- must start putting a LJBF in context. Was there enough report and connection? Do you know her well enough? Yes? Then you're lacking attraction and you have to start showing attractive qualities, start dating others and chipping yourself away from her a bit. Wasn't there a connection? You don't know her very well at all? Then she's probably a tad shy, maybe a little inexperienced sexually, and insecure and most of all you are lacking in building an emotional connection with someone. Just start adding comfort and open up. But it seems the community per default thinks you lack in the attraction building qualities when you tell a LJBF-story.

    The PUA-community focusses too hard on attraction and neglects comfort too much, and I am starting to feel the game is to communicate. Without contact (verbally, physically) there is nothing. But the second goal is to get her be comfortable with you by taking yourself out of the game of seducing her by not trying to friend her nor to bed her, by disconnecting yourself of the outcome, by sharing with confidence what you think without wanting her to agree with you. You have to appreciate her non sexually but for what she does good. Going on her subtle verbal and bodylanguage cues you can start digging deeper, sharing deeper stuff yourself and start appreciating her more and more sexually. LJBF because "she has a friend", "you're not her type", "she thinks you are ugly" is just a hurdle into comfort that can be countered with a "I understand you have a friend, you are getting married, you are terminally ill, I am not your type, whatever... but I think you are really cool and I would still like to get to know you regardless." She knows she has the best sex with someone she feels connected to, we guys still have to realize and know it's just the same for us, instead of wanting to go straight to bed with someone we think is hot. That doesn't mean sex can't happen very fast, that depends on the man's capabilities on picking up cues and responding accordingly, I guess.

    LJBF because you started out like friends and always were friends is something else though, but if there's an emotional connection I would think it can be countered easliy by just withdrawing your attention for a bit and focus on other girls AND other people in general.

    this is just me philosophizing

  6. #16
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    I agree that the community doesn't emphasize on comfort too much and rapport building. Although this forum is a lot more forgiving in my experience. It's an essential part to game. You run attraction so you can genuinely build comfort with her. Attraction allows her to discover that she is slowly winning you over and her reward for her efforts is you start to open up to her and begin to trust her. A guy who goes straight to comfort already sends out signs that he is won over, but only because she looks good. Women want a man to appreciate their character. Even if he doesn't mean it lol.

    And a guy who only runs attraction and tries to get sex comes across as a player. Now, some women are into that. But these women usually aren't the types you want a relationship with nor would she want a relationship with a player. Comfort building in itself is not needy if done right and can help you reach extreme levels of intimacy with a woman you didn't know existed. Which means better sex lol. We are PUA's. Not players. PUA's use their own emotions to their advantage. They get happy, then angry, then sad...all at the right moments so she doesn't feel like you're needy, but opening up and revealing yourself, layer after layer, like an onion. Playing it cool and never wanting to go deeper is what players do. But we are Artists of Emotions. Make yourself into a book she wants to keep reading to find out what happens next.

    There is so much I have learned about expressing emotions properly without losing power that I am about to write an article on it. Did you know that angry people are more likely to be looked at as high value vs someone who is always happy? This goes beyond the typical pickup, but it all goes together perfectly.

    Well that was a bit of an unexpected rant lol. Whew! That was a lot.
    "All things are subject to interpretation. Whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth."

  7. #17
    PUA Bart is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    This becoming a fairly profound topic! I like Ranting is allowed btw

    BTW I really agree with what your sig says. I posted a story in the same spirit of your citation in a topic about height on this forum.

    And about your rant, I think it's better to genuinely care about her character. You don't want to get ending up in an LTR with a nag.

  8. #18
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    To be honest, that signature is the secret to most of my game. Once you understand it completely and wholly, then you become untouchable. Why? Because once you start to recognize that most of what comes out of peoples mouth is BS and that they are just setting a frame, then all you have to do is have a stronger frame. It means that it doesn't matter who is right or wrong, but who has a stronger frame. So when I hear a guy say "My gf won't let me have sex with her." I just smile and say "How come you let her have sex with you?"
    "All things are subject to interpretation. Whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth."

  9. #19
    PUA Bart is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    So we went partying together friday evening. It was fun. I did not build an emotional connection yet with her by telling each other top secret stuff and by telling each other about our deepest fears, beautiful memories, etc... you know. I don't want to rush as it would be strange to all of a sudden open up to her like switching a lightswitch. I want to refrain from building an emotional connection until there is enough comfort for her to come over to my place. BUT I did begin to build report. When she started a conversation and gave me a little nugget about how she experienced something, I gave her a little nugget back on how I experienced the same thing. Sometimes it was the same, sometimes it wasn't, I kept it real and genuine. We were more talkative, I liked that. Before I just avoided any kind of conversation with her and I just teased her all the time or said nothing. Because of it I am still wondering why she still keeps me company and still wants to talk to me... she must really like my looks I guess.

    On a side note, but maybe it's an other topic:
    I went skiing with my best friend yesterday, and we went partying afterwards. Someone came to ask me to dance with her. I showed her my appreciation of her taking the initiative. She visibily liked my appreciation as a smile appeared across her face. We began to talk to each other. And I just applied the same principle: when she gave me a nugget, I gave her one back. If she brought a substantanial contribution to the convo I gave one back, if she didn't I waited for her to do so. We ended up talking to each other in a little corner out of sight, sitting close next to each other. First she had her bag between us, but after a while I noticed she removed the bag and moved closer to me. I reacted by turning my body more into her direction. I appreciated the fact she had so much to tell and that she knows so much (she loves poetry, history and mythology...) and that she got me really hanging on to each word she said because of it. Once she started to talk about relationships and how she never finds a good a lover. I said I know what her problem is: "men are a**holes, and that I should know because I am a man myself." She laughed and I switched topics (I believe it was to early for us to talk about that stuff, and I felt like she wanted me to qualify for her... which probably would have made her uncomfortable if I did as there was not an emotional connection between us yet, but (!) there are tons of report even though I frequently pointed out our differences). We exchanged telephone numbers and we added each other on facebook. We agreed on a date soon (she showed me a photograph of a beautiful place in Ghent. I said I never saw that place. She said she will take me there in the future and to the poetry museum also in Ghent. I took it as a cue for a date so I immediately started scheduling one). One problem... me dating her feels very very wrong: she became 18 2 months ago, I am 30 in a month. But hell, I genuinly like her, and I want to get know her better, so nothing wrong so far.
    Now she is texting me the whole time, and when I appear on facebook she immediately starts a conversation. I really like the fact that she is eager to talk to me, but I really don't know how to handle it. I want to get to know her in person not on facebook or by texting, so I decided not to appear on facebook very often anymore. Other problem, she still needs permission on some things from her parents... so I guess she will have to lie to them when she eventually wants to come over to my place. But maybe that's just her problem.

    I feel like I am starting to really understand the process and for the first time I am starting to feel like a PUA (although maybe to become a real one I will have to try cold appraoches, which I hate... as it feels unnatural and I am all into keeping it real).) I was a nice guy once, I became a jerk later on - which got me layed more, but in the long run, most people just hated me-, eventually I just became distant and hard to get... until recently.
    Now I see it's a process in which you have to reward people all the time for good behaviour. It feels a little like playing tennis. She gives subtle cues and you react accordingly. And how you react depends on the phase you are in together. Is there report and an emotional connection? Then it's ok to talk about each others deepest emotions and sex, then it's also ok to appreciate her on a sexual level and to escalate physically (also on her subtle cues). As long as there is no report or connection? Then it's not ok to do so, you have to try and build comfort by disqualifying yourself to her and showing her you like her as a person and showing other attractive traits.

    What I feel now though, is a little in contradiction of community believes... It is said not to be reactive, but I feel reacting in a proper way to her subtle cues is a key ingredient. Ignoring her cues and doing what you feel like, just shows you don't have social finesse and don't know how to please her. Community also focusses on negs or punishing bad behaviour... while I start to feel negs aren't needed and maybe not the best way to generate attraction, maybe counterproductive sometimes! The community should really focus on how to show real appreciation and on being rewarding for everyone (not just hot girls)! Also something I am starting to feel as an effective technique, is telling her what you like and don't like. It gives her a manual on how to reward you, and on how to really invest into you and she will if you will invest in her.

  10. #20
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    Default Re: LJBF as a result of not enough report and emotional connection

    I am glad that you have started to see these things. Not many do. Understanding that she has to see your interest in her grow naturally is important in creating a genuine connection. You are onto a deeper level of game my friend. It'll be an astonishing journey.
    "All things are subject to interpretation. Whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth."


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