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Thread: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

  1. #1
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Hello All,

    I want some feedback as to how I am handling a friendship* that I have developed with a very pretty and intelligent girl. I suppose she is becoming "more pretty and more intelligent" over time. It's complicated because she was my client.

    I met her via business - I do web sites / web development, technical stuff.

    Sidenote and Question to PUA Experts:
    When I met her (Coffee place), first time we met- First time she saw me, I noticed she kinda blushed / and checked her hair, and went to restroom. (First Impressions - I figure either she needed to go to the bathroom, or she needed to check to make sure she looks good as I was dressed professionally).

    We are both in our 20s.

    After business meeting, as I was packing computer up, we both were talking and got to the subject of "Medical 420." (it helps with creativity and to unwind at end of day for me. it was end of day and after meeting). I learned she shared a similar viewpoint.
    So we went in my car. I said something like "Imma MMJ patient but don't wanna get a DUI (or DWI) by being in the car-drivers seat- Let's smoke in the back-seat. She said Yes and we had a nice lil sesson.

    I didn't intend on anything - Question: If a girl is in the above situation, does it automatically mean she likes me? (I did get her in the back of my car- Rather fast after meeting her, without trying. It just happened. Lol)

    Anyhow, the business project was months ago- After it was over, (all good business wise), I took a break from her. Majority of time we spent and the way I treated her, was "client-zone." I aint gonna let Good Looking Women monopolize my Business-Time and I told them, which was hard to phrase. I told them, "There are good attributes that you girls have- You should know from a social media business perspective many of the people following your (business social media stuff) are doing so for "attribute" related reasons.

    If good looking women want my business I can't mix business and pleasure especially as a one-man-business. I am sure some of you PUA's will dis-agree and my response would be, "My business reputation is one thing I value more than social reputation. I do not care what woman think of socially or else I over-analyse. I do care what anybody and everybody - male or female - thinks of me business wise. Also, it became apparent acting the way I was, was making them interesting in me non-business wise. It led me to observe that..."

    The "Business Game," and the "PUA Game" are nearly identical (with different target goals. )

    Anyhow long story short we started talking again after a few weeks. Me and the girl who contacted me originally. We started hanging out - Movies, Food places,Drinks, etc.

    It's really easy for us to just hang-out, go out for drinks, etc. And I went from "having to view this chick as a client and making sure she aint taking advantage of me" (which I did good if anything I was too business-strict earlier), to viewing her in a better more natural light lol.

    We don't talk about business at all. Anyhow,

    Last Sunday, we went to the movies. I brought "Special Brownies" and I was starting to feel the effects, and was trying to describe the effects, and said, "I think something is starting to feel good body wise." That just came outta my mouth without thinking, I was trying to say brownies gave me a body-high. Obviously it sounds like I was trying to say something else which is what she thought!

    So after I said that, we both blushed and were laughing, hard. (it was very very funny. She was giggling. I think I was too lol)
    .
    She said during the laughter that, "that is a good thing." This was on the way to the movies in car. (I shoud have pulled over and kissed her I probably would have if I werent driving :-(

    That was last week. Now, there is one detail here I should mention to give a more balanced-overview and get more honest feedback from you all, as I know I am making this sound like she does like me.
    She told me a few times she is "seeing a guy." He doesn't live in the same State though so I never cared much about that. I don't care about that except for the fact she is taking a vacation to go see him (he is paying for the plane tickets lol) in a couple weeks.).

    She mentioned that a few times- I remarked that it must be difficult for her, being in a relationship with a guy who is so distant- Even joking, "Hope he is taking care of your needs in this long-distance thing you have." (I don't really care - Except if she is telling me that as a way to say, "Your just a friend." But jealously isn't an issue; I want to expand our friendship (not be exclusive or anything).
    Anyhow a few days ago she needed a simple computer program installed on her computer; She offered to pay me for doing it (I guess because of the business-professional-strictness I displayed earlier.) It took a few minutes and told her not to worry about it.

    She said she'll take me out for a message, literally saying that she'll pay for both of us -- message parlor.

    I know she enjoys my company, (why else would she want to hang-out consistently). I don't know if as a friend or more.

    I don't want her to pay for a message for both of us. Soooooo....

    We don't talk on the phone verbally- We do text but mainly to plan things to do (logistics I guess). The vast majority of the time we have spent together socially communicating / hanging out as been in person.

    I have what appears to be a limited time frame to make a move on her. Because she is the one that mentioned this message parlor thing, I was thinking of texting her, and I needa figure out how to phrase it right, but more or less "give her the option" of "paying for us having a message as she said," or "I appreciate that you want to re-pay me for helping with minor computer thing. But theres no need to pay money for me receiving a message, [you guys can see where I want to go with this.]

    (I dont want to lose her as a friend either though by complicating things but im starting to develope feelings and want to make a move before I develope more feelings and start acting weird or too nice!)

  2. #2
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Seeing as no responses, I should clarify a couple of things, and make some interesting observations.

    I've known this girl for approx. 4 months. The first 6 weeks I knew her where more business related (I handle multiple clients at one time so it's not like I spent 6 weeks working just with her or anything).

    During the time, I friend-zoned myself on purpose before she ever had a chance to friend-zone me, (had I not, I knew during the course of the project I would have been by her. I made it clear business / social must be separate things basically.)

    After project was done... , I didn't talk to her for about a month or so (unless it was a "customer service" legit type thing which was rare). I wanted her to forget the tech. aspect of me that she got to know, and only remember more positive traits (people, when looking back at events, after awhile, tend to remember the positive traits of people as opposed to negative traits as long as negative traits aren't too negative. In my case, tech. speak.)

    So I started hanging out with her a lil more than a month ago.no tec. nor business talk just hanging out (movies, beach, drinks, coffee, etc.).

    We don't talk on the phone, we do text but more for logistical (planning, times that work that we can hang out)- But most communication is done in person when hanging out.



    I noticed that the process of getting clients, meeting them accessing there needs etc. (business game basically) is utterly and remarkably similar to pua game, with obvious target goal differences. The communication aspect, or rather, the "how things are said and done" of business game and pua game are so similar.

    Anyways, I know I only have two posts and am rambling a bit- I want to contribute to this forum as I have a feeling some of you might be able to give me some useful pointers

  3. #3
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Well, even though nobody is responding, I'll provide an update. People are atleast reading this

    After reading through this forum, I think that, because I never ever used Kino, never initiated the invite to hang-out, and in general never really sent signals to her that I liked her.

    I realized nearly every time we hang out she was the one asking me to hang out, here's the thing, nearly every single time.

    However,some of the times she wanted to hang out was I wasnt able to. Yet she kept inviting and initiating.

    Instead of worrying about whether we are only friends, I'll be happy we are friends., I'll simply start using Kino, test how comfortable she is with her personal space (for example I just hung out with her, she was sun burned. I touch to see if her arm was warm. After, she said she felt her body warm (but said cause of sun-burn).

    She didn't seem to have any objections and smiled. Than I touched her forehead to see if it was also hot. She seemd kinda surprised that I touched her (I almost never ever ever "touched her in any way" before and even if I did accidentally I would apologize.

    I'll just keep slowly increasing, than decreasing, but than increasing more, signals and signs of interest.


    I've only recently actually started to act like I have "playful interest" in her, cause I realized (after she sang a song to me, privately, my attraction simply increased.

  4. #4
    cdharders's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Hey. Great set. Sounds like you and this girl really are hitting it off. A few points:

    1) Yes, Pick Up is EXACTLY the same as Business is exactly the same as any other sales occupation; rather than money, sex is the objective. Only difference at a 40,000 foot view. Read the book "Influence" to get a better idea of how general psychology of sales and influence can apply to pick up

    2) Make her pay for the massage. Make her continue investing in the relationship. If a woman ever offers you ANYTHING, accept it. If you reject an offering, she may not give you a bigger better offering later.

    3) She may have been attracted to you when you first met.

    4) I respect you keeping things professional. It can get very dicey, especially if she is the one handling finances

    5) If the guy lives in a different state, he is almost irrelevant. Never bring him up, unless you are in bed, getting LMR and she keeps saying she has a boyfriend. At that point, boyfriend destroyers will come in handy. If he is paying for her plane ticket, that further solidifies the relationship is not that amazing. Bringing up a boyfriend yourself only reinforces that you two should not do anything, so you are shooting yourself in the foot unnecessarily.

    6) I think people get the wrong idea of kino. Kino is necessary, but the right type of kino is necessary. Hand on forehead and hand on forearm are not ideal forms of kino. They are just weird forms of kino. Best ways to kino are fist bumps, high fives, half hugs, then full hugs, then kiss on forehead and side of head, then kiss. Additionally, hand on small of the back, upper arm, shoulder, and side are good throughout set. Now, because you have known her so long, it's definitely a little odd to start kino out of blue.

    Have you at least hugged her? How do you greet each other?

    Best suggestion I have is a blaze out session that turns into petting, then make out then sex. It will all happen in one event, not over a long drawn out amount of time. Understand that you'll put the friendship at risk making the move, but I am always going to say "go for it."

    That is best advice I can offer given the circumstances. When you don't start a set with kino, it's hard to make up for it later.

  5. #5
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    The relationship has taken interesting twists and turns. I'll respond to each point first, than give a (simpler to read than original post) update of things.

    Quote Originally Posted by cdharders View Post
    Hey. Great set. Sounds like you and this girl really are hitting it off. A few points:
    Ya we kinda are.

    1) Yes, Pick Up is EXACTLY the same as Business is exactly the same as any other sales occupation; rather than money, sex is the objective. Only difference at a 40,000 foot view. Read the book "Influence" to get a better idea of how general psychology of sales and influence can apply to pick up
    Yea, it is.


    2) Make her pay for the massage. Make her continue investing in the relationship. If a woman ever offers you ANYTHING, accept it. If you reject an offering, she may not give you a bigger better offering later.
    I am not sure if she literally meant to go get a message, or if that was "girl code." Your right though, I might even mention in very funny way "hey didnt u owe me a message over at that place."

    3) She may have been attracted to you when you first met.
    It seemed that way.

    4) I respect you keeping things professional. It can get very dicey, especially if she is the one handling finances
    Yea. After work was finished I didnt talk to her for a month or two. Than I did and she was down. I'll mention other aspects of that in next post.

    5) If the guy lives in a different state, he is almost irrelevant. Never bring him up, unless you are in bed, getting LMR and she keeps saying she has a boyfriend. At that point, boyfriend destroyers will come in handy. If he is paying for her plane ticket, that further solidifies the relationship is not that amazing. Bringing up a boyfriend yourself only reinforces that you two should not do anything, so you are shooting yourself in the foot unnecessarily.
    Here is how I've been reacting in general to the boyfriend thing. I NEVER bring him up. WHENEVER she does, I only compliment him. I say ONLY good things. I make him seem perfect! The more I do that, the better it seems.

    If I critize in any way shape or form the boyfriend, she will defend him.
    If I only say good things about him, I noticed she switches subjects. Either way it shows NO JEALOUSLY on my part. About the vacation thing, next post.



    6) I think people get the wrong idea of kino. Kino is necessary, but the right type of kino is necessary. Hand on forehead and hand on forearm are not ideal forms of kino. They are just weird forms of kino. Best ways to kino are fist bumps, high fives, half hugs, then full hugs, then kiss on forehead and side of head, then kiss. Additionally, hand on small of the back, upper arm, shoulder, and side are good throughout set. Now, because you have known her so long, it's definitely a little odd to start kino out of blue.
    You right, but I have fixed that sorta.
    I do high five and first bump. Maybe a kiss on the forehead is something I should try but ... what scenario is that cool or ok in?


    Have you at least hugged her? How do you greet each other?
    We hug when we meet and when we are going home.

    Best suggestion I have is a blaze out session that turns into petting, then make out then sex. It will all happen in one event, not over a long drawn out amount of time. Understand that you'll put the friendship at risk making the move, but I am always going to say "go for it."
    It seems like I am putting the friendship at risk by NOT making a move. I'll explain in next post.

    That is best advice I can offer given the circumstances. When you don't start a set with kino, it's hard to make up for it later.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Cool. Looking forward to hearing more insight. Sounds like you've really thought these things through.

  7. #7
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Ok, here is the gist.

    Thursday- I went all AFC and send her a text saying, "I am slowly developing feelings for you. But it's weird cause I see you first and foremost as a friend."

    Her: "Friendship is all I feel for you. If feelings become too much, please let me know as I wouldn't want that.

    Me: (if it where, I would honestly tell you). But it's sorta a relief, and a motivator.

    her: Good! Good luck with the chicks!

    ____________________ ____________________ ____

    Saturday night, I went out and had good luck with other chicks. Really good luck. actually, since saturday i've been just "ability-vibe ultra guy mode."

    Obviously Sunday chick calls me. NOW she wanted to talk about those feelings. She once had a guy friend who got feelings and she said it didnt work out well. I told her that, my definition of "feelings," is texting 4 times without a response.

    I think she is down it seems like I just needa make a move. But atleast I am at the point where it feels like if I DO NOT make a move, THAN i might get slapped!

  8. #8
    cdharders's Avatar
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Quote Originally Posted by WebDude420 View Post
    Ok, here is the gist.

    Thursday- I went all AFC and send her a text saying, "I am slowly developing feelings for you. But it's weird cause I see you first and foremost as a friend."

    Her: "Friendship is all I feel for you. If feelings become too much, please let me know as I wouldn't want that.

    Me: (if it where, I would honestly tell you). But it's sorta a relief, and a motivator.

    her: Good! Good luck with the chicks!

    ____________________ ____________________ ____

    Saturday night, I went out and had good luck with other chicks. Really good luck. actually, since saturday i've been just "ability-vibe ultra guy mode."

    Obviously Sunday chick calls me. NOW she wanted to talk about those feelings. She once had a guy friend who got feelings and she said it didnt work out well. I told her that, my definition of "feelings," is texting 4 times without a response.

    I think she is down it seems like I just needa make a move. But atleast I am at the point where it feels like if I DO NOT make a move, THAN i might get slapped!
    Wow , that is a lot of new info. I think, you realized telling her your feelings thing wasn't a good idea, right ?

    Great to know you're gaming other chicks.

    At this point with her, you should try to escalate next time you see her. Not all kinds of random kino. Try to kiss her. You've put this set into a very odd state. As far as I can see, not kissing her is going to make her think that you are emo and not a man while escalating will at least let her know you are a man with feelings that isn't afraid to act on them.

    Good luck!

    Side note: any new set is 100x easier to close than this set, but you're invested which makes you want to keep going. Appreciate the power of investment ans use it in future sets

  9. #9
    WebDude420 is offline Aspiring PUA
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    Me and her are just friends.

    I did make clear to her that us chilling alone so often was literally unhealthy for me. As I am a horny dude.

    So long story short, we agreed just-friends is fine.

    So last weekend, she had a gathering at her place. At end night, I slept in her room and hooked up with a new chick (one of her friends), while the just-good-friend slept downstairs. She was ok with it.

    And I am talking to another one of her friends (just knockout beautiful. Might hang out today.).

    Just-Friends can be good. Very Good.

  10. #10
    maxtazm is offline PUA Forums Respected Contributor
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    Default Re: Regarding "Business and Pleasure," Situation with Former Client!

    is that really what you want? why would you constantly make so many posts to yourself if you didn't want something more.


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