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Thread: Finding a genuine relationship

  1. #11
    Thrill is offline PUA in Training
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Before I answer your questions, I was also going to make meteora's point, but in more of a numerical context: opening 200 girls in 2 years is slightly less than 2 girls a week on average. That's extremely small. You should be opening more than that per day. I would recommend an average of 5/day. That said, the quality of the pickup is as much, if not more, important than the quantity. You may see people saying that they met 10 girls in one day, but that sounds like 10 2-min conversations with no attraction. Once you get better at pickup, the conversations will be longer and you won't be able to meet so many girls per day, especially while maintaining a life of your own. Bottom line: you need to open up a lot more chicks.

    Also, about wings: they're not necessary. In fact, I've been picking up chicks by myself for so long that I think that I might not be such a great wing. When girls asked me where my friends were, I just said, "My buddy was supposed to meet me here but got sick and cancelled, and I wasn't gonna let that rain on my parade. I'm gonna have fun no matter what!" Girls are really into that kind of confidence, determination, and positive energy. You don't need wingmen, just confidence.

    1. One of my favorite strategies for hitting on chicks when I don't want them to think that I just want to get laid is to make some cocky-funny comment or neg, followed by, "It'd never work out between us," but say that lightheartedly. By automatically dismissing her, but not in an off-putting way, you throw her off because she doesn't expect that and is more likely to continue conversation with you. Another strategy is to make up a time limit, i.e., "I have to jet in 5/10 minutes, but..." Don't force that in the convo. Use it once you start getting a nice flow of conversation going. Lastly, if a girl calls you out on just wanting to get laid, I LOVE SAYING, "Please, you wish. I am not that easy. You'll have to try harder than that." Obviously, say that with a smile. Now, you're putting her in the chasing position and making you the prize.

    2. There are many ways to get around this. Here are two of my favorites, and always smile when you say them to lower women's defenses. Ex. 1: "I know, I don't know you either. That's why I'm still kinda worried that you might be a crazy person. So let's [grab coffee/lunch/walk around/etc.] so people will hear me if I scream for help." Ex. 2: "I know you don't know me, and it's such a shame, but I can help you with that."

    3. I don't stop women on the street so often because I live in NYC where everyone's in a rush. I like coffee shops (talk in line or at a table and sit down with them), supermarkets (neg them on their choice of food), women's section of clothing stores (ask for advice for buying a gift for a friend, mom, sister, etc.), and subways/trains/etc. (you can talk about anything; you guys are stuck there, so don't make her feel cornered but definitely add humor because commutes are boring and you'll stand out more). Also, to make women more comfortable about approaching them on the street, again, make up a time limit so they're not so defensive and concerned about how long you're gonna be talking to her.

    4. Some people learn prejudice from a young age, and that kind of person isn't worth your time or effort because it's ingrained in them. Others are just inexperienced and ignorant. Early in the conversation, make THEM feel different (i.e., neg) and add some sappy qualifier to get them to give you a chance. Ex.: "I can't believe you like X. Normally, I wouldn't connect with someone like that, but you seem different. I have a good feeling about you."

    5. I don't know who told you that you have to compliment women in direct day game because I have never done that and am very successful. In fact, I NEVER compliment women until I'm qualifying them, and even then, it's often a backhanded compliment, like a neg or cocky-funny joke. Especially never compliment a stuck-up chick. That's exactly the kind of person who you neg off the bat. Try it. That said, I wouldn't bother wasting time with a stuck-up person, even if I think that I could successfully pick her up. I get the appeal because you find it validating if you pickup a stuck-up chick, but who cares? They're not worth anyone's time. You're better off focusing your energy on someone who'd be worth spending time with, even if just to make her a fuck buddy.

  2. #12
    fancy16 is offline PUA in Training Achievements:
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    You have written lots of interesting things. Great!

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to fancy16 For This Useful Post:

    Thrill (02-25-2015)

  4. #13
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrill. View Post
    5. I don't know who told you that you have to compliment women in direct day game because I have never done that and am very successful. In fact, I NEVER compliment women until I'm qualifying them, and even then, it's often a backhanded compliment, like a neg or cocky-funny joke. Especially never compliment a stuck-up chick. That's exactly the kind of person who you neg off the bat. Try it. That said, I wouldn't bother wasting time with a stuck-up person, even if I think that I could successfully pick her up. I get the appeal because you find it validating if you pickup a stuck-up chick, but who cares? They're not worth anyone's time. You're better off focusing your energy on someone who'd be worth spending time with, even if just to make her a fuck buddy.
    Thrill, you never compliment a girl in direct day game because you don't run direct game. Everything you just explained is by the book indirect game. Even though you're approaching women during the day you're still using indirect openers and indirect techniques.

    What aussie has been doing is more like what sasha daygame does. If you're unaware who that is you can look him up on youtube. I believe this is one of the most difficult ways to pick up a girl because you have to be unwavering and you're confidence must be through the roof. With the techniques you explained you somewhat fly under the radar.

    The only time I've actually had this type of direct game work for me on a cold approach is when a girl already made heavy eye contact with me. Hence she already told me that she was interested in me. I haven't had good results with it otherwise, but I've only tried it about 50 times, and half of those times were during the night where it's not as effective.

    The area where I've had very good success with direct game is in inner circle game where I already somewhat know the girl and know she's attracted to me. When I say direct I mean it, like anything you think about her, even what you're going to do to her. It's extremely powerful and makes a girl speechless. They immediately get the hopelessly attracted look. The look when their pupils dilate, their mouth opens a bit, and they get that stare like they are in a trance.

    Direct approaches do work. It just takes allot of experience and I've had way more success with indirect game on cold approaches so I always revert back to it. Meteora and I have discussed this in the past and it seems to work the best when you start indirect, then when you've created attraction you go extremely direct. It's similar to Kino's bombshell technique actually.

    There's allot of PUA's that swear by direct game, have written books on it, and there's countless videos on youtube showing it works. One thing about direct game is that the bolder you are, the better it will work for you. W. Anton describes this very well in his book. He says if there's a girl you want to talk to, but she's surrounded by a group of people, just walk right in the middle of the group. Invade everyone's personal space and only talk to the girl. He says that it doesn't matter if you're rude to other people because you're not being rude to the girl you like, and her feelings are the only ones that matter. His philosophy is to not "try" to be rude to others but kindly brush them off and only focus on the girl. The biggest compliment a girl can get is to be approached by a confident male.

    This type of boldness is where I've struggled because I was raised with having good manners. I haven't been able to do that. I have been extremely bold when using direct game after I had created some attraction and I must say the bolder is the better.

    The thing with this type of approach is that you need to do it ALLOT to get really good at it, and 200 times in 2 years isn't nearly enough. For this type of approach, with your limited experience at them, 3 lays is good! With that success rate, if you bumped it up to 400 approaches in a single year, you would be getting 6 lays a year. Even if they weren't the type you wanted a relationship with you would always have a girl to sleep with.

    I used to sleep with a girl once or twice then forget her if I thought she wasn't relationship material. Now I never do that. Keep her around and bang her! It's not worth it to have a one night stand. The sex doesn't compare. Stretch it out. If I hook up with a girl now I hook up with her at least 4-5 times. It's being smart!

    You might write a girl off too early too. Some of the best women I've been with started as fwb because I thought they weren't relationship material. They proved me wrong. You have to give every girl a fair chance. My last girlfriend, who I'd still be with if she didn't join the peace corps, was in this category. I totally wrote her off as relationship material but she was fun to hang out with so I kept having sex with her. She turned out to be super awesome, really good in bed, she cooked me breakfast AND dinner almost every night she slept over (she even brought the groceries needed for the meals), very honest, and gave me morning head to wake me up. I told her I was ok with being in a relationship but I needed to have a threesome every now and then. She agreed to that too and she doesn't even like women! Give every girl a fair chance!

    Holy shit that was long. I'm totally rating this thread a 5 star because it has ALLOT of good information in it from multiple different guys.

    Oh and I forgot, I agree with Thrill. Don't ever compliment a stuck up girl. Those are the ones you neg the sh!t out of, get them to chase you, then bang em and dump em. For some reason those hot stuck up girls just LOVE to be treated like sh!t. Don't give them anything, they are the worst type of woman and are rude to every guy (unless you treat them like crap, then they love you). If she's hot but a sweatheart you can compliment her, and if it's genuine, she will eat it up. Those are the types that deserve the compliment.

  5. #14
    aussiearef is offline PUA Forums Respected Contributor
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Wow this thread has turned into a treasure! Thanks guys you all rock :-)

    Meteora, when you live in a big city like Sydney you get more girls but there are a lot more guys who chase women too! I wake up at 5:30am to exercise, then I go to work and by the time I get back home it's 7pm. While I am doing my desk job, young guys who live with their parents and do not have to work bang the backpackers! There are many guys who approach girls in Sydney so yes you get a lot of women here but a lot of defensive and unapproachable women! Believe me country women are far friendlier and more approachable so although you get a few of them every day you do not have to deal with thick shielded women, stuck up women and women who do not trust men. By the way if you want to come Sydney, just apply for a work and holiday visa and then jump on an airplane and come here. I guarantee you will find a job in no time.

    DirectIsBest is a genius. He does not know me in person but he knows everything about how I approach women! Very clever :-) Yes I approach directly during the day. Reason is that, as I said, I am too busy so I do not have time to go out sarging really. I have to approach women while I go to work or at my lunch break, which means I normally get women who are walking fast or are buying a takeaway lunch etc. It's not a good situation to open them indirectly really. A few times I came up with some nonsense indirect openers (e.g. your perfume smells nice) and I number closed the women like a piece of cake! Indirect works perfectly for number closing but you get a lot of just-friends, and flaky women too. My biggest problem with indirect opening is that I do not know what to say! If you can help me with coming up with an indirect opener that works for me please help me with that.

    I have not approached more than 200 women in 2 years for a reason. 170-ish of women were approached by me in the first 3 months! Then I got disappointed by not getting results and gave up! Now I only approach women that I really like, they look like a nice person, and I can see a bit of attraction from here side too. At 35 I do not feel comfortable approaching every girl who passes me anymore to be honest. I have decided to put more effort into it and approach more women, based on your recommendations, but I want you to know my reason of not approaching enough.

    You guys said I must never compliment a snob. 99% of women I get are those who walk fast on the street. How can I open a snob like that in day game?! I would love to open stuck-up women as a practice of negging and disqualification.


    I know you guys pursue PUA techniques but I have a question here. Imagine Internet dies and there will be no online dating any more. And imagine that approaching women become illegal! What other method would you use to meet women for relationships and not just for getting laid?


    Cheers

  6. #15
    DirectIsBest's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Quote Originally Posted by aussiearef View Post
    DirectIsBest is a genius. He does not know me in person but he knows everything about how I approach women! Very clever :-) Yes I approach directly during the day. Reason is that, as I said, I am too busy so I do not have time to go out sarging really. I have to approach women while I go to work or at my lunch break, which means I normally get women who are walking fast or are buying a Takeaway lunch etc. It's not a good situation to open them indirectly really. A few times I came up with some nonsense indirect openers (e.g. your perfume smells nice) and I number closed the women like a piece of cake! Indirect works perfectly for number closing but you get a lot of just-friends, and flaky women too. My biggest problem with indirect opening is that I do not know what to say! If you can help me with coming up with an indirect opener that works for me please help me with that.
    With your situation indirect won't work. You need some time for it to work and your opportunities are short lived. That being said indirect can get you allot of numbers, but in such a short period, most will be flakes. You should stick to Direct Game. You will get less numbers but the ones you do get will be WAY less likely to flake.

    I wonder what your compliment openers are. If you've just been telling a beautiful woman that she is beautiful it won't be as effective as telling her WHY you think she's beautiful. If you can pick out unique characteristics about her and compliment her on those it would be way more powerful.

  7. #16
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Hey aussiearef, I just sent you a PM. I'd like to send you something that you may find helpful with social circle game.

    I'll also throw in a mental trick that might help you approach in the daytime. If you're like me, you're brain is constantly going, right? It's a guy thing, I guess. Perhaps girls can just sit around with empty heads, waiting for a stimulus, but us guys, we're always thinking about something, right? So my rule of thumb is that whenever I think of something funny, clever, silly to say, I look around for the cutest nearby girl and I say it to her. For instance, I love breaking the ice with a cute girl near me in line at the supermarket by pointing to one of the tabloids and saying, "Can you believe Brad Pitt had a baby with an alien? (or whatever the headline is. And then I ask something like...) Do you think that's really true?"

    Bam. Amazingly effective and insanely simple opener. It can work on cashiers too, if they aren't too busy. Throw the tabloid on top of your groceries, and then let the cashier "decide" if you should buy it or put it back. Heck, maybe buy the tabloid and use it as a prop in a coffee shop. lol. It could be a funny opener there. I mean, what guy reads that stuff in public, right? Just say you wanted to find out what all the fuss is about...

    I'll back off on pushing clubs on you if that's really not your thing... but not before I give you a couple of things to think about. And, btw, I'm 37 and still go to clubs, sometimes alone, so suck it, you damned whipper-snapper!

    First, when you reach a certain age and level of maturity, it's very much more to your benefit to befriend the bouncer/waitresses/bartenders/etc. TIP WELL. And if you can't tip well, tip memorably. By that, I mean maybe have 2 drinks, easy to make, tip a fiver (or whatever you consider to be slightly memorable without being excessive with your aussie currency) and just be a chill cool dude. Don't waste a lot of their time, but be sure to pay a compliment, notice something about them, comment if it looks like they've had a rough night, whatever. The point is, you want those people to remember you. Once you're in with the workers, you'll have a bit of royal status, especially as an older dude. You don't have to go for single night lays, or take a girl home with you if you don't want to. You can run day game in the bar. Just be friendly, cool, chill, have nice conversations, and get the girl's number and invite her out next time you want to go somewhere. I think a lot of guys like us (older, more mature, less eager to just hook up, looking for something that's actually special) reject night game because we think it's all about this high energy malarky where we have to run around like a monkey and drag a girl off to the bathroom to screw. But it doesn't have to be that way. Especially with regulars, we can just be the cool dude that they look forward to seeing, who's nice and fun and funny, and you can transition that easily into a coffee date or something in the day time if you want to. There's no hard rule that says you need to run "night game" at night and shoot for a fast screw in the alley. Just approach, be genuine and fun, actually try to make a connection with these girls and who knows where it'll go from there? Even "good girls" can be seen having a drink in the evening once in awhile. Maybe just avoid the high-energy clubs with outrageous prices and an excessive load of 20-somethings. In general, I avoid those places as well. But there's plenty of in-between places for people who are just going out to relax, laugh and have a drink.

    There are two big advantages to night game that I really think are worth considering. 1. the girls are actually out to have fun, so you can be pretty certain that you aren't interrupting their life or being a distraction by approaching. I mean, this is the time that they designate in their busy life for this sort of activity. So basically, they will all be more receptive, which leads me to point number two. 2. Their energy level is fading, they don't have as much internal strength to say no to something that is harmless and fun, or the mental acuity to get them out of an appealing, but unusual, situation. Basically, they are more willing to go along for the ride, more willing to give you their number or set something up, or whatever. It's the perfect time to get to know someone. I mean, seriously, think about all your day game approaches and tell me that they wouldn't have been better had you both met in a bar, sipping on a cocktail, and both had the time to invest in getting to know each other a little bit better.

    And, btw, if AUS is like the USA, some of those places even have a nice dinner menu. After you've been there a few times, maybe you can ask a couple of regulars to join your table (or join theirs) and bam, now you're running some social circle game, as easy as that.
    Hypnotist, NLP geek. I've done: Tao of Badass, Hacking Attraction, How To Date Multiple Women (Pellicer's stuff), Get the Girl, How to Talk to Hot Women, No Strings Attached (Mehow's stuff), and now I'm getting into RSD's stuff. I don't go out a lot, but I kill it when challenged

  8. #17
    aussiearef is offline PUA Forums Respected Contributor
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Thank you guys.

    DirectIsBest your advice makes sense to me. I normally have a canned opener in my pocket which I say it and then I quickly find something to back it up. I think you are right, it's good to actually know why I like a girl and why I want to approach her. Not only does it make the approach more effective it also lets myself know why I want that girl :-)

    BlackBird, thank you for the PM. I replied on that. Your night game strategy sounds very advanced haha. A friend of mine lives in a shared flat with a guy who is 43 and to be honest is one of the least attractive men I've seen! But my friend says every weekend he goes up to a local bar and brings home a HP10! I was told that a hot lawyer had approached that man in the bar and had asked him to date her!! Now that I think of it, apart from having some magical power that attracts hot men, he must be using the royalty that you just mentioned. He must be getting value from the people and especially the chicks he knows in the bar which makes him look someone interesting. I must have a proper think about what you said, do some research to find a good bar and try to visit that bar every week.

    Yes Australia is very much like the US. That being said, in Australia people are kind of too reserved and so they avoid getting involved in people that they do not know. For example your idea of saying something funny to a random person looks very clever and interesting to me but I am not sure it will work here. As you said my brain is constantly working and since I am a humorous guy a lot of my thoughts are stand-up comedy materials! So sometimes I just say them to random people but they tend to pretend that they do not hear me! It only grabs the attention of foreigners (e.g. Europeans) who are more sociable then they Aussies. The older bunch are a lot better in this sense so maybe I can start with them and then try to connect with the younger ones.

    p.s. Sometimes I go to cafes to have a coffee before work and I see chicks who come in a group to get coffee, and sometimes they check me out. I do not approach them because in a busy cafe opening a 3 set seems scary to me. Do you guys have a suggestion as to how I can open a three set in a cafe?

    Cheers guys

  9. #18
    Adam12 is offline Experienced PUA
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Totally true. I think a wingman is only needed so you look like you have a bunch a friends and its easier to approach groups of girls when your with a wing so it appears youve got friends. most people with "friends" or at least look like they have friends actually have game - there are so many dudes that are introverts and cant make friends so having a wing helps them. you on the other hand are probably secure so you can go it alone. most guys need a wing like me so i can look like im there with good friends then i can split off with my target woman
    Last edited by Adam12; 03-03-2015 at 11:26 PM. Reason: typo's.

  10. #19
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    Quote Originally Posted by aussiearef View Post
    BlackBird, thank you for the PM. I replied on that. Your night game strategy sounds very advanced haha. A friend of mine lives in a shared flat with a guy who is 43 and to be honest is one of the least attractive men I've seen! But my friend says every weekend he goes up to a local bar and brings home a HP10! I was told that a hot lawyer had approached that man in the bar and had asked him to date her!! Now that I think of it, apart from having some magical power that attracts hot men, he must be using the royalty that you just mentioned. He must be getting value from the people and especially the chicks he knows in the bar which makes him look someone interesting. I must have a proper think about what you said, do some research to find a good bar and try to visit that bar every week.
    My night game isn't advanced at all. It's called going out, being social, having fun, and being sufficiently considerate of others that you recognize they are doing the same and invite them to join in the fun if they are reasonably cool!

    And getting comfortable with that. And why shouldn't you be? Being comfortable with having fun? Being comfortable with talking to people? You had those skills when you were two years old. It really isn't rocket surgery.
    Hypnotist, NLP geek. I've done: Tao of Badass, Hacking Attraction, How To Date Multiple Women (Pellicer's stuff), Get the Girl, How to Talk to Hot Women, No Strings Attached (Mehow's stuff), and now I'm getting into RSD's stuff. I don't go out a lot, but I kill it when challenged

  11. #20
    Thrill is offline PUA in Training
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    Default Re: Finding a genuine relationship

    aussiearef, by saying that Aussies are reserved and that you work all day and that Oz is very touristy, it seems that you're making excuses, and that won't help you progress. Besides the fact that making excuses only hinders progress because they redirect focus to things that aren't the true causes of the problem, the reasons that you gave aren't even completely true. First, from personal experience living in Australia, I had many lays. Second, I've seen statistics that Australia has the highest occurrence of threesomes in the world - that doesn't sound very reserved to me. Third, there are reserved people all over the world, just as there are outgoing people, and PUAs do just fine worldwide. Fourth, I highly doubt that every single person you meet is so highly reserved. Fifth, no one likes suddenly getting involved with someone who they don't know - that's why we learn pickup: to get around that. Last, of course saying something clever or interesting to someone would work. Nothing works all the time on all people, but some strategies work better than others. If you say something funny to someone and they ignore you, maybe it wasn't really that funny, maybe you approached them creepily (from behind or out of nowhere), maybe you speak too softly, or maybe you didn't make it clear to the girl that you were talking to her as opposed to yourself or someone else nearby. So none of these "reasons" explain why you have a low success rate. The real reason is simple: you have to open more chicks/sets and get better at doing it, which comes with practice. You won't progress as much if you make excuses as opposed to taking ownership and tackling your weak points head on. Similarly, instead of dismissing these PUAs' advice based on suppositions or past unsuccessful experiences, try them out. You have nothing to lose.

    As for cafes/coffee shops, I love them! I open sets there all the time. You might be scared, but that's normal. The only way to get over it is to face your fears. I don't use canned openers; I prefer situational openers. You can say something funny about some weirdo in the cafe, you can point out a cute child, you can neg the girls on their choice of coffee, or if there's a long line, you can say something like, "hi! let's make a deal. if you let me join you in line so i don't have to wait, i'll buy your drink. i'm in a bit of a rush" (that way, they think you won't stick around long, so they'll be more comfortable around you). there's really infinitely many things that you can say. Specifically for three-sets, if it's a mixed set, approach the guy first. If it's all chicks, address the ones except the one you want most, which is the one you neg.

    Don't sweat rejection; bask in it, and learn from it. You will survive, I promise.


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