Getting out of the friends zone

This is a question that hopefully Marni can help me with.

Several times, I have met really awesome women, that I would love to pursue long term relationships with, only to find out that they are in serious relationships with other men. Of course, I always test their commitment to these other men, (I used to not do that, until I learned that there are relationships, and 'relationships'), but sometimes they really are serious about these other men. In that case, I don't want to just blow them off, because I genuinely like these women, so they get put into the 'friends' category. They put me in the same category. I always have had a knack for being really good at the friends thing. We always develop very close relationships, and they often say that they feel comfortable telling me things that they have a hard time telling there boyfriends. Which brings me to my question. Many times, these women end up breaking up with their boyfriends. How do I break into the possible dating realm when this happens, and how long should I wait to make my move? I have had too many women who broke up, and I didn't make my move until it was too late, and they were off to their next relationship. Other times I have moved too fast, and they pushed away from me because they were still hurting over the relationship.

I have asked some of them, way after the fact, if they would have been open to the concept of dating me. To a woman, they have said, they would have jumped at the chance, but they didn't realize that I even considered them that way, at the time.

I just don't know how to make the transition between the two realms, and when to make it.

Note: This isn't a generic question about moving from friends to lovers. I know better than to get stuck in the friends category unless there are extentuating circumstances like what I have mentioned previously.

Well at least you are WAY ahead of many other men who continuously fall into the friend zone not out of choice.

My first question to you is: "If these women do not allow you to jump from the friend zone to the relationship zone, do you still want to be friends?" second question is "are you really friends if you have an end goal of being something more?" Third is "Is your friendship with this woman distracting you from going after other women?"

These are serious things to consider.

As for transitioning from friend to lover/relationship it's all about going after what you want. If a woman you like breaks up with her boyfriend DO NOT be the shoulder to cry on. DO NOT be her fake boyfriend to fill the void. Falling into either of these categories is typically a recipe for disaster. You can try to make the transfer whenever you like but don't be sneaky about it. Be direct and go after what you want. Sneaky is creepy! I would say to be safe wait at least 4-6 weeks. That way she can get all the back and forth post break up activities out of the way with.

You can still be a friend and there to support her but don't be her girlfriend.

So after you ask these women about their opinions of dating you and they say they would have jumped at the chance, what do you do? Do you make her jump?

Depends. If they just aren't interested, that is one thing, but like I said, most of the time it seems like I just miss the opportunity.

Yes. I can compartmentalize, and I don't obsess. I have lots of friends and I don't need more friends. I have lots of women that I regularly date or have sex with. But, I only go after women that I find attractive on some level other than physical beauty. If there seems to be a deep connection, but a romantic relationship isn't possible because of their current relationship status, I would rather have them as a friend then just blow them off completely. Obviously I find them interesting, and feel that we have some common ground if I am seriously gaming them. Otherwise, I drop them, as soon as I learn that we don't share any common ground.

Heck no. I don't want to be tied to a single woman, and I am definitely not going to spend time crying over something that won't work out, when there are plenty of other women out there. Some of these women, if it did work out, I would consider a serious, monogamous relationship with, but it until we are in that relationship, I don't quit, pursuing other women.

I think that is my main problem, and that was kinda what I was sensing from before.

This isn't like I tell them some sob story and confess my undying love. I have only asked this question long after the fact, when we were firmly established as friends, and we had both moved on to other people, when there would be no possibility of us hooking up. It was something I asked mostly as a point of curiosity and because this issue is something that has always puzzled me, and I have been actively trying to find a solution. I find it to be an interesting challenge that I have never been able to solve well. Which is the reason I asked, not because I really bemoan or miss any of the women, that it has happened to me with, in the past.

hmm... very interesting discussion here. I've got something to add here though, in his case, he's currently great friends with this girl. The girl breaks up and needs some support so first thing she'll think of is to call him. Then she would normally use him as a shoulder to cry on. How do you avoid this?

To put it bluntly, you don't allow it. You have to stop yourself from being there completely for her as a support system. She has tons of other outlets to use. Friends, family.

I am not saying to be an asshole or be cold but you have to be strong against an emotional woman and as a woman I know this can be tough. If you let us lean on you we will lean like nobody's business.

You can assist the girl with quick conversation that help strengthen her but no statements like "if you were my girlfriend I would never ......" You can say things like "you are a strong, intelligent woman. You will get over this but it won't happen if you keep up this attitude."

Strengthen her, lead her in the right direction but don't be her crutch. Because you know what happens to crutches once a person is healed...they get shoved in the closet.